Invisible C4, Need a Fix

[=AirAvenger=]

Being Invisible in Comanche 4 is a real drag sometimes. It Happens to us all at one time or another. Most people have been Ladies and Gentlemen concerning the Invis Issue during play. But getting to the point...

This post is meant for anyone with Ideas or have Noticed anything that may show a pattern for being Invis. Also anyone with code experience that may have any ideas.

I have, as well as a few others, have looked into fixing the C4 Invis Issue. When I have an idea I'll try and check into it, but I'm running out of ideas on where to look inside the C4 game structure. People posting or sending me an email or sending me a PM may give me a fresh idea as to where to look, or how to look into fixing the Invis Issue.

I'm calling on anyone no matter how dumb/smart your idea may be.

Thanx,

[SKIPPY *CFS*]

I cant think of much I put a call to Nova Logic for ya we will see what they have in anything to offer.....

[kill_me{FWD}]

hey Avenger,

did not spent time in how computer games are working - im only using them. so please sorry for my dumb questions. here they are:
i assume, the positioning data of all players are transmitted by the server to all clients? is the position of the invisible player be transmitted also - or not?
if not, then are the clients giving any feedback about the positioning data they recieved?
if yes, then if the client already has the information why he doesnt give the right output to video, sound and radar?
generally, can the c4.exe be modified that the server sends the positions of each player; all clients got then to send a recieve receipt? maybe every minute or so.

if the prob is server side then im sure you'll fix it soon. if the prob is client side then maybe the recieve receipt is a good start, the server then can send an information to the player that he's invis and stopps counting until the player fixed being invis.

again sorry Avenger, but i do not know anything about how the c4 code works.

[=AirAvenger=]

Hey,, Just keep the ideas coming even if you don't know any code. You never know when 4-5 people could have a little idea and it could turn into a big idea to fix something.

[MasterX(BKC)]

Avenger, try relocating the comanche entries in the defs to totally different id numbers and tell the game to use the new numbers rather than oldies, and remove old entries, i think invisibility is the game cant or messes up assigning a def # to the user and without a assigned #it would be "null" and have no mesh or data,
hence invisible and silent,

if the above is not applicable or is false,
try assigning a 3di to the null entry and see if invisibility still happens.....it shouldn't after this, but may have bad side effects beings i think some marker items use null for their phisical definition

[GarretJax]

Hey Avenger.........dont know if this makes any difference but something I have noticed is if theres an Invisible pilot on each side at any given time during the game...they can see each other even though the rest cant see them.......

[W@tchtower*CFS*]

Yep, Garret, it seems to me the pilot that is invisi is visable to the pilot that killed him and got him stuck, most of the time. Something changes in between getting killed and being stuck and/or typing ~resetgames.

[kill_me{FWD}]

by the way
Avenger, would it be possible to have a dedicated server. you know, like in BattleField series or so, that is controllable via remote. the gui is no big help in conjunction with current remotesoftware

[=AirAvenger=]

MasterX(BKC)
Relocating the comanche entries in the defs..

Now there is a Project to try. 3di and game graphic are very tuff for me, but I'll look into that.
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GarretJax
Invisible pilot on each side at any given time during the game they can see each other..

That is a puzzle. I've noticed that too and there could be some kind of INVIS answer from that.
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kill_me{FWD}
C4 controllable via remote..

Not that I'm aware of. I've never ever tried or attempted it. The Host Manager I'm still working on may be some what accessible to help with this.
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Here is a wild thought I also had on INVIS is this:
All of the players in game are in a section of memory and that memory section refreshes to a new section of memory and some of the data does not get there completely.

[WiperSix]

i guess I'm just statig the obvious, but if it was a server side issue then the invis would appear to everyone. my guess is that the client c4 game (the person who has an invis opponent) has somehow not received the info that the invis pilot corrresponds to an active object. its curious that the ammo fired by the invis object is visible though. I have often thought that maybe a patch could be made on the client game so that all comanches flying are visible, but I don't know what happens when each life is destroyed (do those comanches just become invis ?). At any rate, a server side solution would really be ideal because if, for example, you created a patch that everyone could install to their game, all a cheating person would have to do is disable that patch or figure out how it worked to become invis at will. On a separate issue, I noticed from some of the game code that it even has a built in setting for max fire rate, but somehow that is disabled ? It would be nice to fix: 1) invis , 2) 8h, and 3) firerate, as well as have the server provide visual real time ping rate and possibly ping limits . Its been 3 years (?), though, and noone seems to have the skill to do these things.

[=AirAvenger=]

Well I know Bane has looked into the INVIS issue and he also has looked into the code as much as he can, which is more than myself. I know he was saying that many things are just disabled or were not totally working in the code. I wonder if the pre-release type versions had this problem.

I have noticed tons of stuff referenced in the code, but like max fire rate, etc.. it's all disabled some how. So Add-On programs/patches are the way to go for now to try to get things to work.

Does game code ever become public domain after xx many years? I wonder what it would take for Nova to give it to us? It might be a huge PR thing for Nova if they gave it to us. Are there any Software Attorneys in the C4 community that could arrange this?

On a side note concerning the In Game Timer(MTC Multiplayer Timer Clock). I know that at 1 time it functioned for one of the versions. It may have been a pre-release version. I still keep trying to get it to work on it's own. But until then I just keep on using the In Game Timer Option in the Player-Manager.

Thanx for the ideas.. keep em coming..

[XO JESTER_DIE]

good to c some ppl still fighting to get this game fixed...we had this problem when it first came out... and nova said so sad to bad basicly to all of our requests for the code to be fixed...so good luck with it..and the game code as far as i know is copyrighted for a long long time ..they have been fighting for years on some of the code/ games that have become obsolete on the net for many moons..i cant remember the name of the site but all they do is store/share abandoned software they still havecourt battles waging on for stuff that is over 10 years out of production.... i think the site is abandeonedware.com or something like that

cya

THE JESTER <DIE>

[WiperSix2004]

I think its safe to say that they will never, ever release the code. Besides the fact that its simply not in their interest, they could very well have proprietary agreements with some of the staff, investors, and shareholders, not to mention vendors like 3di that provided vital code for the thing to work, most likely under some very exacting agreement.

There's just too much money to be made (or lost) in gaming for any of these cats to start making their own investments (even losing ones) open source, and since they don't own all the code to begin with , it would be really hard to for me to believe that they would even consider it.

but, hey, maybe if someone offered them 10 or 20 thousand US they might at least consider responding to your email hehe (even if the answer was no)

[HotShotFWP]

Hi everybody, good to see some of you I havent seen for a good while.

Avenger, here's some observations of mine related to this invis matter:

1) A player mostly always comes back invis to someone after getting stuck and using "~resetgames."

2) Sometimes (but not as frequent as what I mentioned in #1) a player respawns invis after the first death of a game.

There may be different issues we have to deal with as well, now. For instance, cheating. Recently in C4, I've seen some player named Spirit who can go invis at will. This guy can even fly under the ground and stuff. he can also give himself 1000 stingers or 999, and he can make it so one can shoot like crazy and not kill him as he sits still. He says it's a code he types in, or something like that. I call it a cheat. LOL

I've also seen other players fly under the ground and take many stingers while standding still, or maybe it's Spirit with a different name. Also, I've encountered some players with a killer Cannon. I mean with full health youre dead in 2 seconds. Reminds me of that cannon macro Copenhagan used to use. Are cannons like that acceptable, now?

Anyway, my point is if it's possible to go invis at will, that cheat or code is going to spread, and even if you all fix the invis problem we know about, here is a new invis problem we face. I may just have to find Reaper (I really miss him) and join him in another game to frequent in place of our beloved C4. But, I'll still, play C4, and I'm not saying that the things I mentioned above happens so much that the game is anarchy, now. But, it used to seem more fun to play.

I still like C4, and it's good to see you all still around!

HotShotFWP

[=AirAvenger=]

Originally posted by HotShotFWP

A player named Spirit who can go invis at will.

Well Spirit send me an e-mail lets chat. Here's your big chance for the spot light if we can get INVIS fixed in C4.
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This guy can even fly under the ground and stuff. he can also give himself 1000 stingers.

I can duplicate this, it's almost impossible to stop someone from doing this. There is also prolly a few ways of doing this.
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Not kill him as he sits still.

Sounds more and more like a trainer/cheat program.
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I've encountered some players with a killer Cannon. I mean with full health youre dead in 2 seconds. Reminds me of that cannon macro Copenhagan used to use. Are cannons like that acceptable, now?

Rapid Cannons/Gunz/Cannon Macro/etc.. This is easily duplicated from a stock keyboard/mouse setup built ingame. Pressing 1 while firing cannons gives Rapid Cannons. There are many with Rapid Cannons that are not a Cannon Macro. A Cannon Macro is usually programmed into a Joystick Profile. As far as Rapid Cannons being acceptable I'm sure each Squad has their own Policy on the issue. As far as how fast a pilots cannons are I've seen 2seconds, 10seconds, 1min30seconds.
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My point is if it's possible to go invis at will, that cheat or code is going to spread, and even if you all fix the invis problem we know about, here is a new invis problem we face.

True, but you can always Punt a cheater.
Since I'm on the C4 Game Enhancement Team I have looked into several security/cheat holes in C4 but I really try to effort my time to finding fixes, explore new game types, create the Player-Manager, and other positive things for C4.

it's an Age Old Story::

Game - Player - Challenging - Fun
or
Game - Player - Cheat - Fun

Thanx for the input...